From: heb_roots_chr@mail.geocities.com To: "Hebraic Heritage Newsgroup"<heb_roots_chr@geocities.com> Date: Mon, 29 Dec 1997 03:43:51 +0000 Subject: The Celebration of Christmas
From: Melissa Susco To: heb_roots_chr@geocities.com Subject: Re: THE ORIGIN OF CHRISTMAS - Encyclopedia Britannica A pagan Christmas, or not? just a point to ponder- i could be wrong. i do celebrate Christmas. i am the only one in my family who follows Christ. Being a young daughter of 18 and only Christian for about three years, it is sometimes difficult to live in an unsaved household and be the light. Even though they are not Christian, we have always celebrated Christmas and Easter as a Christian holiday together. It's a great opportunity - an open door - to tell my family more about Y'shua/Jesus. Ordinarily, my family is very strongly opposed to me talking about Jesus. I've been hated and persecuted, yelled at, separated, ....etc- everything except listened to. But I pray for them. Their hearts are so cold and so closed to Jesus, but around these holidays of Christmas and Easter they become more open. It's interesting to me how God can use even a holiday that maybe wasn't appointed by Him but celebrated for Him now to reveal Himself to unbelievers who haven't even asked for Him. We find unbelievers who never go to church sitting on a pew in a Christmas service because somebody made them go, and the Spirit reaches out to them through the "Christmas story" to bring a message of hope and salvation-and people responding and laying their lives before Jesus for the first time. They dedicate their lives to God. If God can use a donkey to speak, can't He speak through a holiday that may have originated pagan, but been transformed to celebrate the birth of the King of kings? just a question. i don't know about you guys, but my origins weren't good. Much like the origins of Christmas began in bad soil, i began in sin- but God transplanted me. He transformed me. we aren't to just to bind the evil, but transform it. Sorrow can't become joy by binding it-doing that leaves it to still exist, just powerless. But if we transform sorrow to joy-it no longer even exists. if you expose darkness to light, it is no longer darkness. the darkness has been transformed into light. i was a sinner with bad origins, but transformed -i am a child of the Light. Do you see? my church doesn't say "we celebrate Christmas because it's about the birth of Christ Jesus and we throw the tree and presents in with it to make it more enjoyable" Christmas isn't just a time of entertainment and materialism for us with Jesus thrown in somewhere. Jesus is the center of this holiday for us. The Christmas tree for us represents the family tree of Jesus, the fulfillment of prophecy that He would follow His father David. During this season we do exchange gifts as unto the Lord that He may be glorified. We do it in worship just as the Magi worshipped and adored Him with gifts. But we also realize that we have nothing to give except that which He has given us to give because He owns everything. In thanksgiving, we give. Dying to our own selfish needs, we open our eyes to see the needs of others and bless them with His love instead of being me-focussed. Maybe I'm wrong, but just as i have been transformed from darkness to light, so has He transformed the meaning of Christmas for me. i not only celebrate Christmas and Easter though, i celebrate every day alike for each new day is His creation, each breath He gives me is unearned but received in grace, and my redemption is eternal because of Him. I am saved by faith through the grace of my Savior, Messiah Y'shua. Conceived in sin, i celebrate daily because He set me free from sin. As believers in Y'shua, we should all rejoice everyday-not just Christmas or Easter or any appointed festivals-but always! Does it matter if we celebrate just a little more concentrated on a day called Christmas than on other days? In a pagan america, can we use a former pagan holiday to reach people with the gospel like Paul used a pagan altar "to an unknown God" to reveal to the Romans who this God he serves really is? It's a close call, after all, He does change ashes to beauty....doesn't He? would appreciate your thoughts. Attached to the Vine, Missy >From Eddie: ************** Missy, I appreciate your testimony and the sharing of your heart. Your testimony is the exact BALANCE that I try to present when we talk about Christmas and the Biblical Festivals on this newsgroup. As I have shared with the newsgroup in the past, I celebrated Christmas and Easter for most of my life. I have seen and witnessed God use Christmas and Easter to touch the hearts and lives of people. I can witness that even though I celebrated Christmas and Easter for most of my life, God still loved me. He still answered my prayers. He still lovingly led me by His Holy Spirit into a deeper and deeper personal relationship with my Lord and Savior. Keeping Christmas is not a salvation issue. I was saved and I kept Christmas. You are saved and you have kept Christmas for the three years that you have been saved and have accepted Yeshua/Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior. The reason why God still can use Christmas and Easter to touch the hearts and lives of people is that God is a God of GRACE, LOVE and MERCY. He still honors when HIS name is proclaimed and HIS message that HE loved the world so much that HE sent His Son Yeshua/Jesus into the earth to be our redeemer and our Savior and to save people from their sins. If God required that those who believe on His name worship God with 100 perfection before He ever worked in the lives of people, then he would never work in the lives of any of His people and there would not be any human beings in heaven. Because God DOES work in the hearts and the lives of His people who attend church on Sunday, who keep Christmas and Easter, I have a problem with those who discover the truth about the sabbath and the Biblical Festivals and become "Anti-Christian" and refer to those who still worship on Sunday and keep Christmas and Easter as pagans. If you have accepted Yeshua/Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior, you will be in heaven and you are therefore not a pagan. What I try to present on this newsgroup is that AFTER we are saved, we need to GROW in our understanding of God and His ways. GROWING is a PROCESS. Growing takes TIME. It is not something that happens overnite. It requires one to STUDY. When we GROW, God requires for us to be MATURE in our walk with the Lord. GROWING in God often requires CHANGE in the way we view God and how we worship and express our love and devotion to God. I went to church for nearly 20 years and NOBODY taught me that the Biblical Festivals meant anything to the non-Jewish believer in Yeshua/Jesus as Messiah. God had to lead me by His Holy Spirit / Ruach HaKodesh (even while I was celebrating Christmas and Easter) to discover the significance of the Biblical Festivals to HIM and therefore their significance to ME. In the process, I learned about the pagan origins of Christmas and Easter. I learned how the Catholic church changed the sabbath to Sunday and documented that they had the right as the "true church of God" and "God's representative church on the earth" to do so. After 20 years of being a believer in Yeshua/Jesus as Messiah, God showed me the truth regarding these issues. In John 8:32, Yeshua/Jesus spoke these words: "And ye shall know the TRUTH, and the TRUTH shall make you FREE" If I believe the words of Yeshua/Jesus, by knowing and understanding the TRUTH of Christmas and Easter and the TRUTH about the Biblical Festivals being HIS Feasts (Jesus died on Passover, was in the ground on Unleavened Bread, was resurrected on First Fruits and the Holy Spirit was outpoured 50 days later on the Feast of Pentecost) and the Fall Festivals teach about the 2nd coming of Yeshua/Jesus and ALL the Festivals together teach about the SPIRITUAL WALK that God desires for EACH BELIEVER, was I now going to call Yeshua/Jesus a LIAR and say that the truth was not going to set me free? Was I supposed to tell the Holy Spirit / Ruach HaKodesh, 'Thanks for telling me the truth but it really doesn't matter if I celebrate Christmas / Easter rather than the Biblical Festivals' ??? Was I supposed to tell God that after HE showed me that HE will REQUIRE that ALL NATIONS keep the feast of Tabernacles during the Messianic Age that it doesn't matter to HIM that I celebrate Christmas and Easter rather than the Feast of Tabernacles ??? If it doesn't matter to HIM, then WHY will HE REQUIRE ALL NATIONS to keep the Feast of Tabernacles? I decided that I wasn't going to fight with God or the truth that HE showed me. He in LOVE NOT CONDEMNATION showed me how HE prefers to be worshipped. I decided that it was in my best interest before God to acknowledge the truth in His Word. I decided that if I told God that the truth in His Word didn't matter then I would be fooling myself. I NEVER felt that my Christian walk in God was now invalidated and God thought that I was a pagan when HE showed me the truth about HIS Festivals and the pagan origin of Christmas and Easter and what HIS word said about MIXING the worship of God with paganism (the golden calf system of worship). I acknowledged the truth. I thanked God that He showed me the truth and the Holy Spirit / Ruach HaKodesh convicted me that with knowledge comes responsibility. I realized from all of this that faith and worship of God is a PROCESS. After 20 years of being a believer in Yeshua/Jesus as Messiah, I was still GROWING. I realized that God LOVED me enough to show me the TRUTH and I LOVED God enough to acknowledge the truth. Many believers get offended when you tell them that something that they are doing is not Biblical. Some think that it will invalidate their Christian life to acknowledge that they have been doing things for years because of Church tradition and not because it is Biblical truth. Some are like the children of Israel and like the tradition of men more than the truth of God's Word. Because your salvation comes by accepting Yeshua/Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior and not whether your celebrate Christmas and because God still uses the "Christmas story" to touch the hearts and lives of people, we must be careful to speak the truth of the Biblical Festivals which is the heart of God in LOVE to our fellow believers. We must SHOW them and ENCOURAGE them to STUDY and eventually keep the Biblical Festivals that GOD gave us to celebrate. Condemnation brings rebellion. But showing the "truth in love" (Ephesians 4:15) helps other believers to GROW in Messiah. Bible knowledge without love puffs up (I Cor 13:2) but knowledge with love edifies. So, while we recognize the love and grace of God to work in the lives of people and to touch their lives for the glory of His Kingdom through an imperfect church and imperfect messages to communicate the Gospel, we also recognize the truth of the origin of Christmas and Easter and the truth that God gave and commanded His people to celebrate the Biblical festivals that HE gave to His people in Leviticus 23. We do this recognizing the difference between salvation and GROWING in the Lord. We also recognize that we need to ENCOURAGE other believers to GROW in the Lord by speaking the truth of God's Word in LOVE to EDIFY our fellow believers and not to condemn them for their ignorance or because of how they have been erroneously taught through the traditions of men. Missy, may God love and continue to bless you! *********************************************************************** From: Dee Crabb To: heb_roots_chr@geocities.com Subject: Re: Christmas Comments and Keeping the Festivals Eddie, I, too, have really enjoyed your very truthful and tactful and honest facts about Christmas and Hanukkah. You have done an excellent job over and over and over again. When we discovered, or should I say, "I" discovered the truth of Christmans, I very easily dropped it like a "hot potato". It was easy for me, but my family had a cow! They wanted their Christmas, and yes, their tree with all the trimmings. I allowed them to have the tree, but they could not count on me to help with it. I was tactful and loving, so as not to offend any more than necessary. I stayed upstairs while they did their thing down stairs. I knew the truth and I would not take part in the ritual of the tree. We don't buy gifts at Christmas for them any more. If we desire to buy a gift there are many other days that it can be done. At first we bought gifts at Hanukkah, but then realized that was a new "tradition" of sorts and not accurate. So now, we give them a gift after the holidays and they enjoy that very much. My point is: When you give it up, you do not do it again, no matter how much you may love your family. You can still have your family gathering, and your meal, minus the non-kosher foods, and still enjoy one another's company. I do not provide the meal any more either. We go to their house since all are married and have a family of their own. They seem to understand, and I do not push them to the way of my beliefs. However, I do supply them with lessons on such matters. And many of these I have printed off recently from your news group. And I know that they do read them, and everything is in G-d's timing, so I do not worry. G-d tells us, that by our obedience our family will be covered, and He will call them when the time is right. So I am confident that that most certainly will take place. Shalom, love to all, Dee. >From Eddie: ************** This year we had no Christmas tree. We never decorated the house for Christmas. I didn't buy presents for my brothers, sisters or mom and dad. However, I did attend the Christmas day meal with the family and was in the same room when presents were exchanged. Afterward, I played cards with my dad and my brothers. Everybody respected my feelings toward Christmas and I respected their feelings. My dad commented afterward that we had a good family gathering. This I believe is the right approach and balance of things with your family. ************************************************************************* From: Chosen Arrow To: heb_roots_chr@geocities.com Subject: Re: Christmas in the Bible The manger........which is in a cave under a church in Bethlehem is actually made of stone. This cave is typical of the type shepherds would keep their sheep. So actually, the manger is not a tabernacle or sukkah at all, rather a stone feeding trough located within a cave-stable for sheep. Most fitting for our sacrificial lamb! >From Eddie: ************** I have been to Israel twice. I have seen the "manger" of Jesus in Bethlehem both times. The guides told us how the site in Bethlehem and some of the other Christian tourist sites came to be in the land of Israel. After the "conversion" of Constantine to Christianity around 321 C.E., his mother, Helen, went to the land of Israel to discover where certain events in the life of Jesus took place. While there, it was told to her that such and such thing probably happened around this spot. So, a church was built to remember the "holy spot" where such and such event happened. This is how the site at the church in Bethlehem where the "manger" is today came to be. So, the "manger" of Yeshua/Jesus is NOT under a church in Bethlehem. Once again, this demonstrates the power that tradition has in the minds of men. As I showed in an earlier note, the manger was actually a type of sukkah. In Genesis 33:17, a sukkah is associated with a place for cattle. The reason why there was "no room in the inn" was because it was the Biblical Festival of Tabernacles and God required all males to be in Jerusalem for the feast (Deut 16:16). The city of Jerusalem was always overcrowded during the days of the festivals so it makes legitimate sense why Mary / Miriam and Joseph / Yosef might not find somewhere to sleep for a night. The Bible story is still more powerful when you understand the "roots" of your faith rather than the traditions of men that the "manger" of Yeshua/Jesus is located below a church in Bethlehem. ************************************************************************